The imminent BAILOUT feels more and more like the COUP D'GRACE to the already accomplished COUP D'ETAT, imho.

There are too many incongruities to view it otherwise. Congress has already been duly chastised for caving in to the inept and lying Bush administration to willy nilly do it again. Plus, the overwhelming sentiment of the Murikin people, across all political and demographic spectra, is decidedly OPPOSED to the $700BILLION-BAILOUT.

Congress knows that the Bush administration is too inept to be trusted, on the basis of its word alone, that such an UNCONSTITUIONAL assumption of debt, with neither responsibility nor accountability should not be granted without exceptional and painstaking scrutiny. We are less than 1 week removed from Paulson's bald faced demand for $700billion and are told that we told that Congress, controlled by Democrats, is on the verge of caving in, yet again, even as the R minority opposes the bailout of an R administration's request.

That can't be. That goes beyond making no sense and can only be understood as a total capitulation by a thoughtless, rudderless, rubber-stamp Congress.

And, apparently, even here, posters would rather talk about Palin this and Palin that.

I'm soul-sickened by this state of affairs. Maybe you are too. Maybe that is why there's precious little current discussion of the matter. Have all of you just given up?

I can't believe we are sitting still for something this atrocious.

I honestly don't think another Bailout thread is going to change things, Jamm.

Best thing to do is stay on the election, attack the Pigs and hope the nation pulls it's collective head from it's collective ass by November.

I've participated in and started at least 100 Bailout discussions, all over the internet, in the last three days.
My head is about to implode.

Be merciful.

I understand. I think you're as sickened by this as the rest of us are. I need help in viewing this in some way results in some hope, but I'm afraid there's no source for that. The election is not a solution because, by then, the debt will have been incurred. Already, Obama has said his proposals will have to be reevaluated and likely postponed. All for the benefit of Wall Street.

The priorities of the US have become abundantly clear, assuming they weren't already. In a week's time, a D controlled Congress has agreed to alot $700billion to Wall Street that will scupper any and all plans that Obama might have had for anything resembling "change."

Why so few bailout threads?

Are you joking? Between bailout threads and 'Obama sucked at the debate' threads there's nothing else going on here.

What is your view of a D controlled Congress' rush to pass a $700billion bailout for Wall Street that is opposed by the vast majority of citizens? How do you square the R congressional minority's opposition to the bailout with the fact that the bailout request comes from an R administration?

Why don't you ask that in one of the dozens of bailout threads that already exist.

The moment to affect this substantially is gone, IMO. Doesn't take too many signatures to release the $350B once the bill is signed.

Americans should be angry, very angry. First that $350B (initial installment) of their tax dollars should be going to the selfsame people who took advantage of the less fortunate. Second, that they had about 10 days to study and become knowledgeable on a subject that was hidden from them by the obfuscations of the Bush regime. Officially, we're not even in recession yet, are we? Third, Americans should be angry that for all the highly paid, free market economists with loud bullhorns, they couldn't even foresee the coming crisis on WALL Street, much less the real one on Main Street.

This Republican administration has done the shittiest job imaginable for the American people.

The best thing to do now is forensic financials. The root cause was NOT subprime lending, although that contributed to the immediate crisis in a big way. We need to get at the REAL ROOT CAUSE (I offer Reaganomics, trickle down, deregulation, Wall-Street-first) as the bankrupt economic ideology which caused this snowball. In addition to ROOT CAUSE ANALYSIS, we need to do IMPACT ASSESSMENT (on the middle class). It would have been better to do this when setting policy, but we really do need to point the finger of blame here; otherwise the crooks will simply hide for a while, then come back to screw us all again.

Well, if what you're saying is that posters here would really prefer threads on Palin this and Palin that, then, yes, I understand and accept that the bailout issue is simply not that important to posters here.

Indeed, maybe Free Republic is a better forum for discussing the bailout. After all, R congressional reps are responding to the public's huge outcry against the bailout, while Pelosi &co do their cave in thing -- AGAIN.

Because progressives have never really done the ground work to organize people in any meaningful way. We pretty much talk shit and run campaigns that nobody takes seriously.

dessalines,

Actually, progressives did a lot of ground work and were on the verge of emerging when we got crushed by McCarthy. Although McCarthy was certifiably insane, he succeeded in totally crushing the progressive movement in the USA and crushed we remain. In fact, everytime we raise our heads, we get hammered again. The hammering has now succeeded in even eliminating virtually all meaning and signficance to what "liberal" means, let alone progressive.

There is virtually no difference between Obama and McCain and for good reason. The USA has no political diveristy that is allowed to vie for public office and that is the intent of the system. Were it otherwise, Wall Street couldn't get $700billion in less than a week's time when it felt a need for it.

Hi there.

Not sure if you saw these:
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11060
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11055
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11022
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11056
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=10233
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11026
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=10779
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11011
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=11000
http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...showtopic=10960

I'm guessing you didn't. Just because people aren't saying what you want to hear doesn't mean that making your own thread is going to give you want you want instead.

I wasn't clear enough. I said "bailout threads right now" which was intended to reflect the fact that as one looks up and down page 1 of this 'Election 2008' sub-forum, there were virtually no 'bailout' threads currently active. Yet, in terms of what's happening, Congress is busily betraying us. It occurred to me that perhaps people were just so sickened that they chose not to deal with it. In fact, that is what 'kona' alluded to, I think.

I can relate to bumping heads against brick walls. But still, I just couldn't give up quite that easily, I guess.

In addition, the D controlled Congress bears responsibility here. I know, as well, that there is reluctance among you Ds to engage in self-criticism. As I've said before, I don't have that restriction because I ain't a D; I'm progressive.

I'm not a D; I just know when a dead horse is dead.

Nothing worth another thread has happened on this topic. You may as well bump every other dead thread on the bailout because everything that there is to be said has been said.

You still think it's a dead horse now that details of bailout are in process of being released (still can't see them, website crashed)?

Personally, i'm keeping busy reading the actual bailout bill, which is currently on the Huffington Post.

No of course not now.

Don't blame me for not being a soothsayer. It's not my fault I couldn't see two hours into the future.

Also, all 10 pre-proposal bailout threads are still up. And there are already other threads about the proposal. This thread doesn't need to exist.

Actually I would like to revise my statement. Everything good about America in my opinion has been through the hard work of progressives or liberals. My statement was limited to the 20 years or so.

Well, I hate to sound like Mike Malloy...but I think most of the top political leaders in this country have been completely and totally corrupted. I heard that the approval rating for congress is around 9%. Even the coporate media acknowledges that the majority of Americans are against this bailout, and it is obvious that most members of the 2 houses of congress don't care. Why should they? Nancy "Nip-Tuck" Pelosi is a shoo in for re election, because Cindy Sheehan (remember her) is no real opposition. The dems are stabbing Obama in the back as we speak...Obama won't be able to implement his plans because there won't be any money.

I'm too depressed to be angry.

"This thread doesn't to exist" SNARK! ( used cap lock) Rude! (changed font color) Jkun17, you are a bully! My God! This is just a message board, jamomius can start a thread, it's no big deal. (increased font size)
Life is more than cute cat pictures, the USA is going right down the shitter! (bold and underline...so there!)

Jammonius, do not call yourself a progressive when it's dead obvious you are an extreme libertarian who wants everyone to hate Barack Obama.

Can't speak for everyone, but I've been out of town for a few days. Has anyone posted a link to the text of what whatever was the subject of today's tentative, compromise agreement?

Over the years we have been so worn down by the Bush Crime Family that our outrage reserves are all tapped out. The Wall Street bailout is just too big, too complex, and too scary for most people to comprehend right now. Sadly, I think that's probably true for me too to some extent. I'm almost ready to let the financial pirates make a run for it with our gold. If we can just elect Obama-Biden and escape this regime with our lives it will be a relief.

After all, it's a small planet and karma is a bitch

$0.02

Not all of us feel that way. Palin is the Neo-Con's Choice for President. Barbie wears what she is TOLD to wear! But the MSM focuses on this PLOY of ROVE and the NC, because they are part and parcel to the cabal that has had this nation in lock-step with these brigands. The MSM is the "tool" of the Fascist regime that has had this nation's future, by the throat. Propaganda is the way of the corrupted, whether Germany, Indonesia, the US, or total oligarchical societies such as CHINA.

Corporate interests NEED the Madison Avenue "touch" to sell their product and control to the public. Our government is the mechanism by which the ELITE [privileged and highly powerful families] hold and DIRECT the policies of AMERICA. We are feed BS and Kool-aide to keep us in tow...following their path.

The MSM plays barbie, and entertainment subjects to keep us "occupied and/or entertained". Control the thoughts of the people[fear and greed] and you control the nation. The Romans were experts at this with their Gladiatorial games thru out the empire, and the army , the 28 legions scattered thru out the realm; all under their commander and chief, the emperor and his Praetorian guard! Nothing new under the sun, except the means of communication. The Fear factor of being found to be in disfavor, with the Imperial edicts or the emperor was suicidal. And the army having to defend the enemies of the state, terrorists,etc. was handled much as it is today---Conquer and conversion to the ways of the elite.

The Constitution has placed a barrier, a means of protection for our masses...IF the MSM does its constitutional job. Provide the facts , all the facts of the matter, to the people...as they[the facts] are unscathed, open and readily available before the citizenry, all citizens, not just the favored few! The problem with AMERICA is and has been -a free and uncorrupted press corps whose main agenda is NOT talking points, but the truth of a matter, with all the facts laid out before the people.

Instead, FEAR has been placed in the minds of the people, thru constant "repetition of the mantra" of the Ruling class[the few we call the elite] who do not rule by honest and fair elections; but control the message of the "news source" by intimidation and corrupt means. We are the beneficiaries of such a media, whose focus is Not truth, but Madison Avenue marketing of half truths in a "pretty package", or a horror tale{the Russians are Coming; the terrorists will kill us; the bogeyman is waiting "for you", etc.

We function as a society either by the manipulations of greed, or Fear! "The Sky is falling" if told , if repeated by enough sources [MSM and government pundits] . we will definitely begin to BELIEVE the LIE, the Canard, the government which mouths such lies[ex. GWB administration]. Would Mom & Dad do that to me??? You bet! They have! Just look around, really look and see what is real, and NOT real without the Kool-aide, or what ever they are pushing for us to SMOKE

Smoke & Mirrors: thru the looking glass Alice! We all need to re-read Lewis Carrol's allegory on the British empire very carefully and Consider its message; a message as alive for today's America, as it was for 19th century Britannia! Empire is empire.



That is...with the help of the MSM!

Save that energy for the revolution and I ain't talkin about Ron Paul. Brb... I gotta go practice my jeet kun do and store up food supplies. Chuck Norris is going down.

Most of them seem to be in the Geneal Discussion thread and at this link you can listen to a Treasury Call on the bailout

http://forums.therandirhodesshow.com/index...view=getnewpost

Huffington Post has text (110pgs) of the bill, but it's not in a user-friendly format.

Also, Kucinich says bill might not pass. I don't know if his floor debate3 was on c-span or not, but it appears there is some D opposition to the bailout:

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Kucinich_say...votes_0928.html

So FEW?

Maybe 'coz everyone starts a brand-new thread even if there are a dozen on the same topic. People don't talk to each other here anymore - they just yell something out into the void.

Um... I like the bailout plan.

I think Obama is wisely not trying to sell it. But make no mistake, it has his complete approval.

The "not talking to each other part" has more to do with left leaning Dems frustrated with those in the center and vice versa.

As a middle of the road Dem (Not "middleoftheroad", yikes) I've very excited that common sense may once again be at the root of our laws and policies.

As the Wall Street bailout talks continue, a critical Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) is not confident that House will pass the legislation, as he told The Hill. "If the votes were there, this would be on the floor," he said. "The votes aren't there."

"Is this the United States Congress or the board of directors of Goldman Sachs?" Kucinich asked today. "Why aren't we helping homeowners directly with their debt burden? Why aren't we helping American families faced with bankruptcy. Why aren't we reducing debt for Main Street instead of Wall Street? Isn't it time for fundamental change in our debt-based monetary system, so we can free ourselves from the manipulation of the Federal Reserve and the banks?"

Kucinich attended a meeting of the "Skeptics Caucus," organized by Rep. Brad Sherman (D-CA) and consisting of House Democrats skeptical of the bailout effort. The meeting's speakers included economic professor James Galbraith of the University of Texas and former FDIC chairman William Isaac. Sherman called the legislation a Bush administration "power grab" and a handout to Wall Street. "This is greatest shift of power to the imperial presidency and the greatest shift of wealth to a still wealthy Wall Street that anyone could imagine," Sherman said.

"None of this has been subject to a critical analysis," charged Rep. Kucinich. "We haven't had access to the books to the people who are claiming they are going broke."

"They rushed this Congress into the Iraq resolution and look what happened," he added, comparing the rushed tone behind the bailout effort with the push to invade Iraq, "Catastrophe for this nation as well as for the people of Iraq."

"The $700 billion bailout for Wall Street is driven by fear, not fact," Kucinich said on the House floor Sunday. "This is too much money in too a short a time going to too few people while too many questions remain unanswered. Why aren't we having hearings on the plan we have just received? Why aren't we questioning the underlying premise of the need for a bailout with taxpayers' money? Why have we not considered any alternatives ...

ANYBODY HAVE A LIST OF THE CONGRESS PEOPLE IN THE SKEPTICS CAUCUS?

All my respect to Dennis but that is a terrible comparison. Iraq didn't need or require any action taken on it. There a rush to a resolution wasn't reasonable much more required.

Try www.openleft.com/ for info about the Skeptics Caucus. I don't know if it lists the members. Chan ces are the group is too amorphous for a detailed list. People drift in and out depending on the issue at hand.