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Randi Rhodes Message Board > Main Forums > Focused Interests > Iraq / Afghanistan
CowboySteve
Charley Reese, a wise fellow with whom I do not always agree, opines on Iran.

I think that the childish and petulant PNAC neoKon folks will upset the applecart, not to "win" anything, but rather just to destroy things because they did not get their way - "things" being the United States of America. I believe that someone who damages the United States of America by means of war, in order to punish Americans, is perhaps somehow analogous to the bad folks who knocked over our skyscrapers.

Charley just comments upon the utter stupidity, without my paranoid suspicions:
QUOTE
One gets the impression that there are some people in Washington who believe that Israel or the U.S. can bomb Iran's nuclear reactors, fly home, and it will be mission complete.

It makes you wonder if perhaps there is a virus going around that is gradually making people stupid. If we or Israel attack Iran, we will have a new war on our hands. The Iranians are not going to shrug off an attack and say, "You naughty boys, you."

Consider how much trouble Iraq has given us. Some 4,000 dead and 29,000 wounded, a half a trillion dollars in cost and still climbing, and five years later, we cannot say that the country is pacified.

Iraq is a small country compared with Iran. Iran has about 70 million people. Its western mountains border the Persian Gulf. In other words, its missiles and guns look down on the U.S. ships below it. And it has lots of missiles, from short-range to intermediate-range (around 2,200 kilometers).

More to the point, it has been equipped by Russia with the fastest anti-ship missile on the planet. The SS-N-22 Sunburn can travel at Mach 3 at high altitude and at Mach 2.2 at low altitude. That is faster than anything in our arsenal.

Iran's conventional forces include an army of 540,000 men and 300,000 reserves, including 120,000 Iranian Guards especially trained in unconventional warfare. It has more than 1,600 main battle tanks and 21,000 other armored combat vehicles. It has 3,200 artillery pieces, three submarines, 59 surface warships and 10 amphibious ships.

It's been receiving help in arming itself from China, North Korea and Russia. Unlike Iraq, Iran's forces have not been worn down with bombing, wars and sanctions. It also has a new anti-aircraft defense system from Russia that I've heard is pretty snazzy.



Charley calls it "stupidity." I call it "malice." The soldiers and seamen and other GI's won't call it anything. They'll be dead.
Ishmael
He's actually being optimistic. The Navy's own war games of this scenario(before they changed the rules to ensure a US win) showed that virtually every US Navy Surface ship in the Gulf was sunk. So the REAL question should be,

"How will the President tell the American people that 3 complete carrier battle groups or a total of 40-50 ships are sunk.
pestone
QUOTE (Ishmael')
So the REAL question should be, "How will the President tell the American people that 3 complete carrier battle groups or a total of 40-50 ships are sunk?"
"Mission Accomplished." dry.gif
AboutBreath
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 2 2008, 10:43 AM) *
I think that the childish and petulant PNAC neoKon folks will upset the applecart, not to "win" anything, but rather just to destroy things because they did not get their way - "things" being the United States of America.



PNAC no longer operates under that mask anymore but under another mask of sorts in which they are not done. Wars 'over there' will continue on now, no matter what we do here. Bush has delivered that for the old PNAC and the Christian Right. Oh yeah, those AIPAC guys too. So, do not fret, our final demise is still on course in Bush's 'Mission Accomplish' legacy.
11bravo
If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring

men shall possess the highest seats in government,

our country will stand in need of its experienced

patriots to prevent its ruin.

Samuel Adams
Alildotonearth
QUOTE (11bravo @ Jul 4 2008, 10:21 PM) *
If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring

men shall possess the highest seats in government,

our country will stand in need of its experienced

patriots to prevent its ruin.

Samuel Adams


You have to understand Bush as the world understands Bush. His failure to compromise on any deal is a sign of his stubborness. And that stubborness made Cowboy dim-plomacy and contract negoiation the norm. His own mother, former First Lady Barbara Bush said of her son George, "He don't listen to anyone".

He told a foreign leader that God told him to invade Iraq. He told his wife he had a dream that he was to become President of the United States, interesting. His former counselors were the uneducated and self-professing genous Karl Rove, the singing Attorney General John Ashcroft, who just loves to "sing" before the Heritage Foundation when he should have kept his mouth shut according to me. Other Counselors were Harriet Miers who they tried to shove up to the Supreme Court like she was John Bolton herself, speaking of reasonable accomadation. And of course the former Attorney General with a failing memory, Alberto Roberto Gonzeles. In and out of the Whitehouse was Katherine Harris, say isn't Harris County Texas, the home of Houston, Texas, that is interesting too.

But you know, Conflict of Interest is ok even if Public Administration and Quality Assurance Professionals know that it can lead to castrophic failures. Conflict of interest are ok from Halliburten and its subidiary KBR, did they dump that liability off yet, to Hunt Oil to I don't know. Lots of no bid emergency contracts through Afganistan, Iraq and Katrina. Speaking of which, what was Bush doing riding his mountainbike during that time period ? Maybe Senator Larry Craig knows, I am not sure. Then there is a Bush Family member selling cds to Hurricane people under federal contract. The list just goes on and on.

Basically his act has gotten very old now, and Americans are probably the last to see right through him. Sometimes a sign of Honor is resignation. One more White House insider resigned just before this Holiday.

Rogue is an interesting word, especially when it comes to allegations of rendition and torture because Bush stated several times, "America does not torture". Cheney thinks a little dip is cool I guess, a no brainer to him. No fuckin brains alright, no fuckin brains, common sense, logic or intuition.
AboutBreath
QUOTE (Alildotonearth @ Jul 5 2008, 02:06 AM) *
You have to understand Bush as the world understands Bush. His failure to compromise on any deal is a sign of his stubborness. And that stubborness made Cowboy dim-plomacy and contract negoiation the norm. His own mother, former First Lady Barbara Bush said of her son George, "He don't listen to anyone".



Bush doesn't listen to anyone, but he was also greatly guided by the PNACers as to how he should 'waddle' along in his presidential crusade. Bush has been a puppet all along. He was given possibly 3 wishes by his Daddy's Gang to do whatever he wanted as his prize/reward for being their puppet cover. GW was and still is that stupid to see what he was guided to do and what he himself has done to endanger the entire planet. The Neocons doesn't care because they made huge amounts of money at the taxpayers expense thanks to Bush's ignorance.
CowboySteve
Somehow, the PNAC has not lit up the average American's radar screen as a fundamental threat to our liberties.
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