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Randi Rhodes Message Board > Main Forums > Focused Interests > Iraq / Afghanistan
CowboySteve
Name the politician who said this.

QUOTE
But there is another factor that I want to talk about tonight, and that is not only the fear of inflation and future inflation, but the fear factor dealing with our foreign policy. In the last several weeks, if not for months, we have heard a lot of talk about the potential of Israel and/or the United States bombing Iran. And it is in the marketplace. Energy prices are being bid up because of this fear. It has been predicted that if bombs start dropping, that we will see energy prices double or triple. It is just the thought of it right now that is helping to push these energy prices up. And that is a very real thing going on right now.

But to me it is almost like déjà vu all over again. We listened to the rhetoric for years and years before we went into Iraq. We did not go in the correct manner, we did not declare war, we are there and it is an endless struggle. And I cannot believe it, that we may well be on the verge of initiating the bombing of Iran!

Leaders on both sides of the aisle, and in the administration, have all said so often, "No options should be taken off the table – including a nuclear first strike on Iran." The fear is, they say, maybe someday [Iran is] going to get a nuclear weapon, even though our own CIA's National Intelligence Estimate has said that the Iranians have not been working on a nuclear weapon since 2003. They say they're enriching uranium, but they have no evidence whatsoever that they're enriching uranium for weapons purposes. They may well be enriching uranium for peaceful purposes, and that is perfectly legal. They have been a member of the non-proliferation treaties, and they are under the investigation of the IAEA, and ElBaradei has verified that in the last year there have been nine unannounced investigations and examinations of the Iranian nuclear structure and they have never been found to be in violation. And yet, this country and Israel are talking about a preventive war – starting bombing for this reason, without negotiations, without talks.

(The) resolution, H.J. Res 362 [listed as H. Con. Res 362 online] is a virtual war resolution. It is the declaration of tremendous sanctions, and boycotts and embargoes on the Iranians. It is very, very severe. Let me just read what is involved if this bill passes and what we're telling the President what he must do:

This demands that the President impose stringent inspection requirements on all persons, vehicles, ships, planes, trains and cargo entering or departing Iran, and prohibiting the international movement of all Iranian officials.


This is unbelievable! This is closing down Iran. Where do we have this authority? Where do we get the moral authority? Where do we get the international legality for this? Where do we get the Constitutional authority for this? This is what we did for ten years before we went into Iraq. We starved children – 50,000 individuals it was admitted probably died because of the sanctions on the Iraqis. They were incapable at the time of attacking us. And all the propaganda that was given for our need to go into Iraq was not true.

And it is not true today about the severity [of the need to attack Iran]. But they say, "Yeah, but Ahmadinejad – he's a bad guy. He's threatened violence." But you know what? Us threatening violence is very, very similar. We must – we must look at this carefully. We just can't go to war again under these careless, frivolous conditions.
GCurry
These days, finding the answer to this is a matter of Googling the opening phrase of the quote. Ron Paul.
CowboySteve
QUOTE (GCurry @ Jul 3 2008, 07:32 AM) *
These days, finding the answer to this is a matter of Googling the opening phrase of the quote. Ron Paul.

Yep, that part I know. What I'm trying to get at, is where in hell are the rest of Americans on this? Isn't 70%-something close enough to a majority for politicians to jump on the bandwagon?
CowboySteve
PS: This points out a terrible indictment of our citizenry. In the 60's America was bitterly divided over the Vietnam War. The minority anti-war folks brought out their argument so loudly, that a divided America decided that the war was not in America's best interests.

We have had a minority consensus since 2004 that the war was wrong. Over the last four years, this has grown to a majority. And we still are at war. And we might start a new war with Iran. And the candidates are hedging their bets.

Why will nobody listen to America, why will nobody take Americans seriously? If there are 70% on one side of the balance scale, what hidden and mystic "dark matter" is weighing down the other side? Why are we afraid of the "other" to the degree that we are terrified of not winning, not stopping the war?

The war has become institutionalized. That's why nobody hears of Cindy Sheehan anymore. She quit. She asked "WHAT NOBLE CAUSE?" And we answered, um, we don't need noble causes no more. That's so last millennium, sis.

We will blunder and bungle our way along in an empty and purposeless combat, in the manner that the Soviets did in Afghanistan when that war dealt them their mortal blow. Their military-industrial complex was unstoppable - until it was stopped by the cold hard hand of economics and reality. Now that same hand comes our way, at a hundred-and-a-half bucks per barrel of oil. The US Military uses 50% of our refined oil products. Now, do you get why the prices are floating up so high? Without oil, we cannot run our military. The US Military uses about 1800 gallons per second. That idea is sixty years old, a brain-child of Krushchev. And we still don't get it.

PS: Some simple math for you - A barrel of oil is 42 US gallons. Each barrel is refined into about 25 gallons of gasoline. Therefore, $150 dollars worth of oil produces 25 gallons of gasoline. The mathematics says that $6 worth of oil produces one gallon of gasoline - not accounting for refining costs. Yes, the other refining products are sold, and drive down the cost of gasoline. But think about this math, please.
Tyo
End the occupation, don't attack Iran? Where's the profit in that approach? The voice of the people is little more than white noise in the background. Our corporate masters have absolutely no reason to pay attention to us. Unless we decide to stand up and give them one and that will take more than just being disgruntled.
cpvon
Wow, that was powerful. Thanks Cowboy Steve!

I had to look up when he said it:
Statement on House Congressional Resolution 362 before the US House of Representatives, June 28, 2008

Just a few days ago.
AboutBreath
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 3 2008, 09:55 AM) *
where in hell are the rest of Americans on this?



They are in an imaginary place of complacency, while the wheels falls off their vehicles and the roof falls in of their homes.... but they all listen to every pre-scripted word these politicians tells them every darn day!! Too bad folks like Dennis Kucinich and Ron Paul are completely ignored for standing up for truth and justice.
11bravo
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 3 2008, 10:26 AM) *
PS: This points out a terrible indictment of our citizenry. In the 60's America was bitterly divided over the Vietnam War. The minority anti-war folks brought out their argument so loudly, that a divided America decided that the war was not in America's best interests.

We have had a minority consensus since 2004 that the war was wrong. Over the last four years, this has grown to a majority. And we still are at war. And we might start a new war with Iran. And the candidates are hedging their bets.

Why will nobody listen to America, why will nobody take Americans seriously? If there are 70% on one side of the balance scale, what hidden and mystic "dark matter" is weighing down the other side? Why are we afraid of the "other" to the degree that we are terrified of not winning, not stopping the war?

The war has become institutionalized. That's why nobody hears of Cindy Sheehan anymore. She quit. She asked "WHAT NOBLE CAUSE?" And we answered, um, we don't need noble causes no more. That's so last millennium, sis.

We will blunder and bungle our way along in an empty and purposeless combat, in the manner that the Soviets did in Afghanistan when that war dealt them their mortal blow. Their military-industrial complex was unstoppable - until it was stopped by the cold hard hand of economics and reality. Now that same hand comes our way, at a hundred-and-a-half bucks per barrel of oil. The US Military uses 50% of our refined oil products. Now, do you get why the prices are floating up so high? Without oil, we cannot run our military. The US Military uses about 1800 gallons per second. That idea is sixty years old, a brain-child of Krushchev. And we still don't get it.

PS: Some simple math for you - A barrel of oil is 42 US gallons. Each barrel is refined into about 25 gallons of gasoline. Therefore, $150 dollars worth of oil produces 25 gallons of gasoline. The mathematics says that $6 worth of oil produces one gallon of gasoline - not accounting for refining costs. Yes, the other refining products are sold, and drive down the cost of gasoline. But think about this math, please.


60's anti war unity was called a draft. From what I see in this country today is nothing but lips and do nothings.
CowboySteve
QUOTE (AboutBreath @ Jul 3 2008, 04:05 PM) *
They are in an imaginary place of complacency, while the wheels falls off their vehicles and the roof falls in of their homes.... but they all listen to every pre-scripted word these politicians tells them every darn day!! Too bad folks like Dennis Kucinich and Ron Paul are completely ignored for standing up for truth and justice.


The sad thing is that people who govern themselves based upon complacency will only awaken when they are hit with disaster. All of the current and upcoming catastrophes that this nation will face over the next few years could have been avoided by the attentive and prudent action of its citizenry. We were asleep at the wheel.
who
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 3 2008, 09:55 AM) *
Yep, that part I know. What I'm trying to get at, is where in hell are the rest of Americans on this? Isn't 70%-something close enough to a majority for politicians to jump on the bandwagon?


Where in the Hell are the rest of Americans on this? I'd say that they are in the same cozy little comfort zone that they retreat to whenever someone correctly points out that 9/11 had to be an inside job.
CowboySteve
QUOTE (who @ Jul 5 2008, 07:03 AM) *
Where in the Hell are the rest of Americans on this? I'd say that they are in the same cozy little comfort zone that they retreat to whenever someone correctly points out that 9/11 had to be an inside job.


But as for 9-11 being an inside job, the water is considerably more muddied than this one. Simple math here shows anyone that we are dead in the water, with NO controversy over it.

The 9-11 story is still not all out yet.
KimFromLongIsland
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 3 2008, 09:26 AM) *
Name the politician who said this.

Ron Paul is the reason for my signature (a play on an old Reagan saying).
Seeker1
Ron Paul's racist swill

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/01/16/...in3721817.shtml

(Political Animal) RON PAUL'S RACIST SWILL....I haven't blogged before about James Kirchick's piece in the New Republic that blew the whistle on the years worth of racist swill that was published in the Ron Paul Political Report during the early 90s, but to make a long story short, it turns out that during the early 90s the Ron Paul Political Report published years worth of racist swill.

Over at Reason today, Julian Sanchez and David Weigel do some further investigating and come to this conclusion:

Ron Paul may not be a racist, but he became complicit in a strategy of pandering to racists — and taking "moral responsibility" for that now means more than just uttering the phrase. It means openly grappling with his own past — acknowledging who said what, and why. Otherwise he risks damaging not only his own reputation, but that of the philosophy to which he has committed his life.

Question: what's the difference between a "racist" and someone who was "complicit in a strategy of pandering to racists"? Nothing, as far as I can tell, except that at least the former is bit more honest about things.

So as damning as everyone thinks this stuff is, I think it's even more damning than that. We're not children here, after all. It's plain that Paul knew what was being published in his newsletters. It's plain that he was familiar with the well-developed strategy that inspired the early-90s turn to racist demagoguery. It's plain that he knew it was a key part of his fundraising appeal. Paul can weasel all he wants, but it's plain that he endorsed a strategy of overt appeals to racist sentiment in order to build support for his political career. If he's given all that up since then, it's only because he no longer needs it.

This whole affair highlights one of the reasons that I wish everyone would stop swooning over minor candidates who play the part of bold truthteller. When you have no chance of winning and therefore nothing to risk, it's cheap and easy to stick to your guns. But as Ron Paul has shown, back when it actually mattered he was willing to do whatever he needed to raise money and rekindle his political career. I don't doubt that he'd do it again if anything serious were on the line.

[snip]




carmenjonze
QUOTE (Seeker1 @ Jul 5 2008, 06:26 AM) *
Ron Paul's racist swill

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/01/16/...in3721817.shtml

(Political Animal) RON PAUL'S RACIST SWILL....I haven't blogged before about James Kirchick's piece in the New Republic that blew the whistle on the years worth of racist swill that was published in the Ron Paul Political Report during the early 90s, but to make a long story short, it turns out that during the early 90s the Ron Paul Political Report published years worth of racist swill.
[snip]


Was this written before or after he took donations from Stormfront? (rhetorical question)
CowboySteve
Adding the postscript in the cited article:
QUOTE
POSTSCRIPT: This is also why adults should stop taking fruitcakes seriously. A guy who's a loopy conspiracy theorist today was probably a loopy conspiracy theorist yesterday, just with different conspiracies. It's only a matter of digging them up.

So in current American politics, there's only the Establishment and the Can't-Win-Crazies?

Boy, are we screwed.
CowboySteve
TNR quotes the "Ron Paul (Political?) Report" here. This thing is ghastly. The site storing the download is the New Republic.

Ma Jones has an article on his presidential bid. There's also something on divestiture and returning of a campaign contribution from a racist.

Interesting diagram here from Ma Jones on political spectrums and Paul.

Again, why aren't the major candidates saying this stuff? The quote above is not inherently obnoxious, even if the fellow has had a history of bad behavior and belief.
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