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CowboySteve
Gravitational energy stored in the planets.

If one considers how planets interact, they have forces that pull them towards the sun. The formula for this is:
Click to view attachment
The numbers are awful to look at, but solve quite easily.For the Sun and Jupiter,
  • G is approximately equal to 6.67 × 10−11 N m2 kg-2
  • The mass of Jupiter is 1.90E+27 kg.
  • The mass of the sun is 1.989E+30 kg.
  • the distance from the Sun to Jupiter is 7.79E+11 meters

They pull together with a force of 4.16E+23 Newtons

So what?

Well, the world's energy utilization is 4.62E+17 BTU per year. ref. This is 4.87E+20 Joules.

Still so what?

Bottom line - if we could somehow harvest the gravitational energy between the Sun and, say, Jupiter, by "stealing" energy from its orbit about the sun, the World could steal all the energy it needs from the orbit of Jupiter about the Sun - causing it to move slowly towards the Sun at a rate of ONE MILLIMETER A YEAR. Or the thickess of a dime.
There is so much energy stored in the orbital character of this one planet alone, it would take a million years of energy harvesting from Jupiter to cause its orbit to diminish JUST ONE KILOMETER from 778,547,200 kilometers to 778,547,199 kilometers. There's that much energy. It would take 600 billion years for Jupiter to decrease its distance to the Sun by 0.1%

It's out there.
All we need to do is figure it out.


PS: Check the math.
PPS: I ignored the effect on kinetic energy. If you're so smart, figure the exact answer out yourself.
PPPS: If we stole the energy from the Moon's orbit about the Earth, it would move the moon about 2.5 meters/year closer to the Earth. After a million years, the Moon would be 1% closer to the Earth than it is now. (If that freaques you out, the Moon is already wandering further away from the Earth from tidal effects, about 4 cm/yr.)

Enuffathat.

Are there any other mega-sources for energy that you know of? It's out there - we just gotta figure out how to get it. (And make sure that Cheney doesn't get his mitts on it.)
Alildotonearth
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 7 2008, 07:49 PM) *
Are there any other mega-sources for energy that you know of? It's out there - we just gotta figure out how to get it. (And make sure that Cheney doesn't get his mitts on it.)


Cats, live cats, the future is in live cats. Well, solar is interesting if anyone has actually calculated ground absorbtion of solar radiation and then release or radiated ground cooling in calories each day. There is this caloric absorbtion and then release every 24 hours. That number has got to be incredible like a mega source maybe ?

But hey, what are you planning to do with this energy, move to point A to point B, heat your home, grow food maybe ? I can't stress enough that probably the oldest and most effecient designs is a plant. Photosynthesis converts solar energy, soil and water to produce fiber, like hemp. I got a cool pair of hemp shorts for the summertime.

So anyway, quid pro quo. I am thinking about writing a book but my writing skills are not too good. I had to lay off my secretary under an arrangement because she threatened to tell her husband about my behavior. So, I thought an illistrated book would be good. So what do you think about this title: The G-String Chronicles ?

GCurry
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 7 2008, 04:49 PM) *
Gravitational energy stored in the planets.

If one considers how planets interact, they have forces that pull them towards the sun. The formula for this is:
Click to view attachment
The numbers are awful to look at, but solve quite easily.For the Sun and Jupiter,
  • G is approximately equal to 6.67 × 10−11 N m2 kg-2
  • The mass of Jupiter is 1.90E+27 kg.
  • The mass of the sun is 1.989E+30 kg.
  • the distance from the Sun to Jupiter is 7.79E+11 meters

They pull together with a force of 4.16E+23 Newtons

So what?

Well, the world's energy utilization is 4.62E+17 BTU per year. ref. This is 4.87E+20 Joules.

Still so what?

Bottom line - if we could somehow harvest the gravitational energy between the Sun and, say, Jupiter, by "stealing" energy from its orbit about the sun, the World could steal all the energy it needs from the orbit of Jupiter about the Sun - causing it to move slowly towards the Sun at a rate of ONE MILLIMETER A YEAR. Or the thickess of a dime.
There is so much energy stored in the orbital character of this one planet alone, it would take a million years of energy harvesting from Jupiter to cause its orbit to diminish JUST ONE KILOMETER from 778,547,200 kilometers to 778,547,199 kilometers. There's that much energy. It would take 600 billion years for Jupiter to decrease its distance to the Sun by 0.1%

It's out there.
All we need to do is figure it out.


PS: Check the math.
PPS: I ignored the effect on kinetic energy. If you're so smart, figure the exact answer out yourself.
PPPS: If we stole the energy from the Moon's orbit about the Earth, it would move the moon about 2.5 meters/year closer to the Earth. After a million years, the Moon would be 1% closer to the Earth than it is now. (If that freaques you out, the Moon is already wandering further away from the Earth from tidal effects, about 4 cm/yr.)

Enuffathat.

Are there any other mega-sources for energy that you know of? It's out there - we just gotta figure out how to get it. (And make sure that Cheney doesn't get his mitts on it.)

I don't know yet about harvesting orbital energy, but sounds promising if there is a way. But I believe that it might be a good idea to look at the problem globally, as you suggest.

The avenue I'd like to see explored is to develop a global per capita energy budget, derived in a goal directed way from desired global energy expenditure, and expected population growth. Then work backwards in a goal-directed way.

For example, suppose the 'target" global energy expenditure is (E, C) - E total global energy expended in joules, say; C total carbon emissions to avoid significant global warming ....

Set it back to allow for "headroom". New target is (.5E, .5C) - or whatever. Per capita target for energy is (.5E, .5B)/6B. In ten years it might be (.5E,.5C)/9B, so dropping. The global target might have to decline to figures determined from sustainability viewpoints, and are probably mostly fixed, but the population keeps growing.

I think if we did this, we'd find that, the most important things we have to do are along the lines of (decreasing priority order):

1. Find ways to live differently so that we use per capita FAR less energy
2. Begin actively looking for sustainable energy sources and develop them
2. Conserve
3. Find new sources of energy

I believe that Americans, as a class, consume far too much energy per capita, and yet seem to determine what many people in other countries "aspire" to as "the good life". Formula for disaster.
CowboySteve
QUOTE (Alildotonearth @ Jul 7 2008, 06:07 PM) *
Cats, live cats, the future is in live cats.
Too hard to light. Won't stand still,
QUOTE
Well, solar is interesting if anyone has actually calculated ground absorption of solar radiation and then release or radiated ground cooling in calories each day. There is this caloric absorbtion and then release every 24 hours. That number has got to be incredible like a mega source maybe?
Everything about the sun that we can use to pull energy from, is very promising. Solar radiation dumps huge amounts of power onto one side of the earth, which then radiates it off on the dark side at night. Go for it!
captainkona
Hemp. It's all about Hemp.
Alildotonearth
QUOTE (captainkona @ Jul 7 2008, 11:52 PM) *
Hemp. It's all about Hemp.


Hahahahaha, Hemp is where the future is my boy, Hemp is the future. There is an American competitive advantage already in progress. Gots to stay at least 5 years ahead of the game. God Bless California.
Alildotonearth
QUOTE (CowboySteve @ Jul 7 2008, 10:59 PM) *
Too hard to light. Won't stand still, Everything about the sun that we can use to pull energy from, is very promising. Solar radiation dumps huge amounts of power onto one side of the earth, which then radiates it off on the dark side at night. Go for it!


I know but as you referred to Cheney, these greedy bastards would torture someone for a new idea. Alot of things are on hold until January of 2009, until then, drink the Kool-aid, high oil prices are here to stay wink.gif.
captainkona
QUOTE (Alildotonearth @ Jul 7 2008, 11:56 PM) *
Hahahahaha, Hemp is where the future is my boy, Hemp is the future. There is an American competitive advantage already in progress. Gots to stay at least 5 years ahead of the game. God Bless California.


Oh yes. Hemp cannot fix everything, but it can fix so many problems it would have a tremendous impact on the overall energy crises. Probably eliminating it.

Then there's food. Hemp is food.

smile.gif
Sinisterblogger
What we need is a giant mutant hamster in a wheel.
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