Full story:
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N07438178.htm

When I was visiting a friend in Amsterdam a few years ago, I broke my ankle. I was staying at the top of a very old, tall building with no elevator. I needed to go to a hospital but could not manage the descent. Happily I was shocked when a very kind, young, emergency doctor paid me a house call. He set my ankle and fixed me up very nicely, for a nominal fee. From my viewpoint, the Dutch system rated an A+, even for a visitor with no claim to their national health care. I wish my encounters with the American system were as efficient, affordable and pleasant as that experience was.

In 2000, the WHO ranked France as having the best health care in the world, while the United States languished in 37th place.

I've posted this article to my blog. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

You are corrrect. This is shocking. He set your ankle without an x-ray. How did he know what he was setting?????????????. What about crutches, plaster, splinting materials. Some fractures need surgery. To me this is ATROCIOUS Care!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, each to his own!!!!!!

Encourage all of your doubting associates (friends?) to watch SICKO before the vote.

But alas, Big Insurance and Pharma aren't patriotic enough to let Americans have Single Payer Universal health care.........

Yeah!!

I saw SICKO.

I remember how Moore tried to tout the Cuban health system. Yeah right!!!!!!!! He showed the one good hospital in all of Cuba which is open to high level Cuban officials and foreigners only.

I have a friend who until recently was going to Cuba to visit her family. The city her family lives in has a population between 75000-100,000. She is afraid to go back because a member of her family who took her around was promptly fired.

Anyway, there are no MRIs and one CT scanner. The equipment used for sterilization is the old Autoclave from the years before Castro. The medications used there are those no longer used in this country. She took blood pressure medications with her because the meds used there are what was used here 40 years ago. There is no cardiac catheterization, bypass surgery, no dialysis, etc. A friend of her family went to the hospital because she was vomiting blood. She was given some iron pills, wished good luck and sent home.

BTW-Cuba has one of the best infant mortality rates in the world. In the US, the physicians try to save compromised fetuses and infants. In Cuba, if you are found to have a defective fetus before delivery, abortion is forced, and that is a fact. Can I find you a source at the present time? No. But you just ask any Cuban refugee, ask anyone who has visited family there and they will tell you the same story.

SICKO, my foot!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes are health system needs to cover all, but the worst of it is still better than any other country's

Well, you have jumped to an erroneous conclusion. He came to me and assessed my situation. He did not feel I needed to go to the hospital or that I needed an x-ray, but he offered me that option. He came with all the materials you cited in tow. The result was excellent, but if I needed follow-up, a hospital visit or additional care, I had his phone number and was advised to call him and it would be arranged. My ankle healed very well and I was not subjected to the impersonal, standardized, commercialized, financially exploitive U.S. health care system.

How irrational it is for you to criticize the care I received, when you were not there and do not know the details of the situation and did not have the experience. I was there. It happened to me and I am merely reporting what occurred. I am an open-minded person who is not convinced that the American way is always the best way. I was not prejudiced or fearful about the European system of care, their alternative methods and systems, having already lived in France and England. I was aware that they do things differently than we do, but not always better and certainly not always worse. I was grateful for the care I received which was careful, personal and professional. The cost was low but the care was high.

Jerry, do you work for the health care industry? Do you think that the American way is the only way? Let me assure you that many people in foreign lands are blessed by their health care systems and would not trade it for ours, if given the choice. Yes, I know that people of means often ccome here for serious operations when they are gravely ill, but for the majority of the people, that is not an option. For standard procedures, I am not convinced that the American system is better or more advanced, and it certainly is not as accessible or humane as the systems I encountered in England, France and Holland.

Jerry, it is a false choice to ask us to choose between the American system and the Cuban system.

More likely, we are focusing on the Canadian or European models as systems to emulate.

We all should recognize that more wealthy countries tend to have more innovative equipment. But we should also recognize that accessibility to the masses is poor in the the USA. For the millions who have no access to health care, they are better off in a less wealthy, less innovative health care system which is actually available to them, than in a system which leads the world in innovation but shuts its door to them.

The main problem I see in the American health care system is GREED. Too many doctors who wouldn't be doctors, if the financial rewards were not so high. Too many private hospitals which put profit above sound medical care. Too many hands in the pie. HMO's and insurance companies scheming to rig the system according to their bottom line, instead of what is best for patients. And the scoundrels in the U.S. government who are beholding to the health care industry for contributions have allowed the money grubbers to run the show. They even allow them to write legislation.

Who is finally going to stand up for the people of this country and assure that every American has a RIGHT to decent health care, regardless of their economic condition? They have been promising us a new, improved system for decades, but they have sold us out to the highest bidders. Do not be deceived by the naysayers who warn us of substandard health care in foreign nations. They are bought and paid for by the health care industry, which is fighting hard to keep their profits high at the people's expense.

Hey Jerry, remember we have an embargo against Cuba, so how would they get an updated Auotoclave system if we won't let them have it? DOH! You seem to be so consumed and scared about a doctor making a house call, why is that scary to you? My Dr. still does make them, and he recommends if I have to go into an ER, same as the Dutch. Wake up amigo, you are in the minority, which I suspect you have been since high school. And who caused them to be so far behind the curve? WE DID!!! So if you care about infant mortality soooo much, why don't you contact your senators and congressman to reverse it? Oh wait, I know why, because you don't give a shit about the people, you only care about your politics, which is undoubtably RW. So where is your compassionate conservatism? I'll tell you where, no where, you never had it.

Hi Guys!!

Let me respond to the last 3 posts in order

Eyes first post!!

You stated that "I broke my ankle." You didn't have an x-ray. You don't know if you broke your ankle or not and neither did the person who examined it. Some fractures can be very subtle and if not treated properly can cause serious complications. Was he actually a physician?? I would be willing to bet you that he wasn't

You stated that he brought up all of the necessary equipment in tow. These would have included splints, different types of crutches, walkers, plaster rolls, basins, etc. You said that you were in the top of a very tall building. This guy must have been Hercules.

You like the system in England?? Yes the English like their system because it is all they know. Impersonal. Are you kidding. I know individuals who have used that system. First of all, my wife used that system. She was in London and had a flu like symptoms. She went into one of the clinics and took a number. After a couple of hours wait, she was able to see someone (who may or may not have actually been a physician), who asked her what was wrong. She told him and he asked her to open her mouth, then gave her some pills and said good bye.

Suppose you are 61 years old and you need dialysis in England (or Canada for that matter). What do you think happens?? YOU DIE!! Or if you need a bone marrow transplat, YOU DIE!! If you need to go to a hospital, do you think you are 2 to a room as in the US?? No, you are in a ward with 11 other people separated by curtains. You need to have your cataract fixed. In this country it is done next week. In England, the wait can be as long as a year.

Eyes 2nd post

Eyes, if you read my post, I was responding to the poster who asked if I had seen SICKO. I used the Cuban analogy because Michael Moore made a big deal out of it in the movie. He went there with his crew and extolled the virtues of the Cuban medical system. I was just responding to that post.

TapDuncan's post

The problem is that in today's world, there is little that can be done by a physician for a patient at home except to clean wounds, change dressings, etc. and that can be done by nurses or nurses aides. House calls are not a productive or efficient method of medical care, except in limited circumstances. What can you physician possibly do for you in your home?? Incidently, how much does he charge for a house call??

You should also know that the reason why our infant mortality is as high as it is, is that in this country, fetuses are brought to maturity or close to it only because of superb prenatal care and advanced technology. For example mothers in premature labor can be treated here so that the fetus can survive in the uterus long enough to survive outside. These premature infants are at tremendous risk to die which explains the reason for our infant mortality. Another reason is that many of are babies are the products of drug addicted mothers and are at increased risk of dying after birth.

You are wrong about sterilization equipment such as the old auroclave system. It can be purchased all over the world. Much of our sterilization equipment is not even manufactured in this country. Cuba allocates very little money for its health care system. They just don't purchase much.

Tap-I am happy to debate these issues with you. However, why do you feel that it is necessary to make derogatory personal statements about me, simply because I don't agree with you.

With that said, I do agree with both of you about the need to cover all Americans. It is a problem that needs to be solved.

Jerry

yeah, all americans need to be covered, but which corporation should profit off of denying medical claims of the populace?

Which CEO that the public has little control over should be in charge of setting deductables? Of which procedures are allowed or not allowed for your particular medical problems?

You seem to be confused here - so let's see if we can rid you of the delusion. First off, the health care system for single-payer will not be in the business of PROFIT - hard to assimilate, I know, but try. The single-payer health system modality that I've seen is actually based on preventative care, not palliative treatment. Wow - what a concept. Treatment of all matters is based on a "best outcome for the patient" modality - not "what can we screw this person and their insurance company out of" method of operation.

So the blood-sucking CEO's of the current for-profit systems better start learning Chinese or Russian - their particular form of crime will still be welcomed there - for awhile. Very shortly, they will be persona non grata around here....along with Blackwater, Booz Allen, RAND Corporation, Halliburton, AIPAC, CACI, etc.

This all of course, relies on people that accept a paradigm shift in reality. If you can't accept the gear shift, get out of the car.

Kyoti

No, I know what you're talking about and I agree with the single-payer system, provided that the system is not a corporate-owned, accountable-only-to-shareholders system.

Opponents say that they don't want socialized medicine. I've seen one too many people hurt on the job here in Texas not get the medical care that they need because health insurance companies weasel their way out of it though using their own doctors or by making a maze of red tape to keep you from getting the care that you pay for and need.

I had a filled tooth go bad on a Saturday. I went to school, and made it almost all the way through my class when I asked my brother to drive me home. From there I was pawned off onto my dad who drove me to the emergency room in Los Angeles. There I stood in line for half an hour, and signed my name on a list. Two hours later I got called to fill out paperwork, I passed out at the desk from the pain. They put me in a wheel chair and pushed me off to a corner. One hour later they took my blood pressure and sent me to a room. One hour later a nurse walked in, I was in tears my body violently shaking from the poison now attacking my nervous system, she offered me an aspirin. My dad looked at me, "Son, that's an 800 dollar aspirin!" I looked at him, "Get me out of here!" I went home and suffered in my own room till morning. I got a hold of my dentist and he prescribed some antibiotic and made an appointment for me the next day. Once I got the penicillin, the pain was gone in 1/2 an hour. I suffered for over 12 hours. Since then a lady died and the janitor mopped around her. The 911 calls were all over the news. The operator told the people to quit bothering her. Our system is soooo broken. My pal had a heart attack, the ambulance wanted to take him to the same place I walked out of. He got out of the ambulance because the refused to take him to his doctor which was closer. They ended up tackling him, police got there and handcuffed him, then they found out he was having a heart attack. They told the ambulance to drive him to his doctor, this is 45 minutes later. One hour passes and they get him to his doctor. The doctor told my pal, if he had gotten there 45 minutes earlier, they could have saved him from heart damage.

Where on earth did you hear that? Got a link that supports your claim that there's an epidemic of peopel dying in England and Canada for lack of dialysis or bone marrow transplant? I know you right wingers believe that the rest of the world's health care systems suck even worse than the US's, but even for right wing propaganda that's over the top bs. You make it sound like there's the rest of the world having 3rd world health care, and the US, as if that's a decent model to go by.

Yes, he was a physician. At least he was called Dr. So-and-So. The last time I took my brother to the emergency room here in the states, although we were promised a doctor would be right in, he was never seen by a doctor at all, but, after a long wait, by a nurse practitioner. She did a fine job of administering care to him and we had no complaints, apart from the fact that the staff called her a doctor and led us to believe she was a doctor, but in fact, she was not. Also, I once visited a clinic stateside several times to see a doctor and found out later that the man who examined and treated me was not a doctor, as I had been led to believe, but some sort of physician's assistant. On the issue of full disclosure, the Dutch win hands down, in my experience.

The Dutch doctor checked me out to decide what needed to be done. Then he went down to his vehicle and brought up what he needed. No Hurculean feat was involved.

England? Yes, I found the system far superior to ours from personal experience. Again, I know what I am talking about first hand. My husband and I had a doctor in our neighborhood. She was one of several in the practice. If we needed care, we could call the practice and receive an appointment that day or even a house call that day, if necessary. That is not true here with a family doctor. Rarely can I get an appointment on the day I call in.

Impersonal? NO. My doctor would see me on the street and inquire about my husband's health or remind me that I needed to come by and let her examine my breasts. Let me tell you a little more about what health care is like there. When you go in for a sore throat, you are not asked to disrobe and submit to a full exam. They look at your throat and take your temp. They may test for strep. They treat what is necessary to treat and leave alone what it is not necessary. Only in a full physical would you be asked to submit to the full protocol. There is no incentive to overtreat. Unnecessary tests and scans are not recommended. There is no profit motive in busy work which pads the doctor's fees. There are no privately owned machines to be paid for. It's very cost effective and streamlined. But it is not inferior care. In fact, they treat the whole individual from a health standpoint, including mental and dental health, not a sickness standpoint.

When you visit the doctor, you take a number when you come in, unless you require immediate care. When your number is called, you go in. The system works quite well and you do not wait more than you do here in the states. Often less, in fact, since you can be seen that day and not weeks from then. Having lived there, I know many people who used the system, as well as myself and my husband. There are always little complaints in any system but few Brits would consider exchanging their system for ours. Besides, you fail to mention that anyone who wishes to is free to go for private care. The care I am describing is FREE AND ACCESSIBLE TO ALL. Before I lived there, I was sick when just visiting and was seen by my fiancee's physician immediately and with no charge, also.

With regard to your wife's case, I cannot comment on it. Did she go to a doctor's surgery or a private clinic? Did she receive free care? Most people I know, including myself, do not go to the doctor when experiencing flu-like symptoms. The fact that she was seen that day by a British doctor seems a plus to me, not a negative. Do you think a Brit visiting us here would receive better treatment than your wife got? I doubt it, since so many American citizens are denied good care here. I see no reason to doubt that your wife saw a real doctor, unless it was specified that the person was a nurse or some sort of assistant. I never went to see a doctor but was given a nurse instead while in the U.K. Your suspicions seemed unfounded from where I sit. What kind of treatment did you expect she should be given for flu-like symptoms?

Please show proof that dialysis patients or those requiring bone marrow transplants are left to DIE in the U.K. I doubt that's true.

With regard to waiting for cataract surgery, yes, there is some waiting time, but not as long as you suppose. That happened to my mother-in-law. Again, if you want a quicker result, you are free to pay for it, as you must in this country, and go the private route. I personally have needed cataract surgery for some time but cannot afford to have it. If I still lived in the U.K, I would have had it long ago.

With regard to hospital rooms, yes, they do use wards in the U.K. It was very like the place I went to have my tonsils out when I was a girl here in the U.S. If you want a private room, you can always go the private route. The setup I saw in the U.K. is much like the intensive care wards I have seen here in the states.

Excuse me, if I missed your answer, did you say whether you are in the health care business or not? I just wonder why you are so adamant in proclaiming the British system inferior?